EP 511. Making Outdoor Dreams Reality

Ramsey Russell: Welcome back to Mojo’s Duck Season Somewhere podcast where I got a great story for you all today. And this story actually started at Delta Waterfowl Expo, where a man I had not yet met came up to me at breakfast, introduced himself, Mr. Leroy Martin from South Carolina. I was sitting there having dinner with my boys and which I don’t get to see as much as I’d like to see anymore because of travel. And he began to tell me about this organization he’s a part of, Outdoor Dream Foundation, and invited me to share a duck blind with some of their beneficiaries. And I got to tell you, it punched me in the stomach, you all. I’ve always said life short, get ducks. But this particular invite, it kind of sort of just grabbed me, punched me in the stomach. And I thought about it for 2 or 3 weeks and I called up Leroy and that’s how this meeting came to be. Joining me today from the Outdoor Dream Foundation is Leroy Martin, Mr. Richard Cranes, and Skip Still. Gentlemen, how are you all doing?

Skip Still: Wonderful.

Richard Cranes: Doing good.

Leroy Martin: All right.

Ramsey Russell: We tried this and I’ve never had this kind of technical difficulty recording a podcast over zoom. You all convened at a library and there was no Internet because of Internet line. A major Internet line had been cut in South Carolina. What are the chances? But welcome to the show, gentlemen.

Skip Still: Thank you.

Leroy Martin: Thanks for having us.

Ramsey Russell: Let me start this right here. What is the Outdoor Dream Foundation? What is the Outdoor Dream Foundation?

Skip Still: You want me to take a jab at it?

Ramsey Russell: Yeah, man. Everybody just jump in.

Skip Still: All right. Well, we were founded in 2004, and I can tell you the first hunt we ever had. We had a young man named Isaac Ponder. And Isaac wanted to go rabbit hunting, and he wanted to do some other type of hunting, this was his second or third about of leukemia, and he decided he just didn’t want to fight it anymore. He wanted to live life on his parameters and he wanted to go out that way. And we took him rabbit hunting, and then Brad had him lined up on a fishing trip down in Florida, and we did that. And we did this because some other organizations would not get involved with things that had guns. Great organizations, but just didn’t want guns involved. And we took this young man rabbit hunting and had a good time. 15 days later, the young man passed away. And that’s when Brad and Leroy and others decided, we need to make this thing go. And that’s kind of how it got started. It was 2004, and since that time, we have taken 2500 or 3500 east from 40 states all over North America. So that’s kind of how it got started.

Ramsey Russell: Skip, that’s a great explanation. Were you on that hunt with the young boy that went rabbit hunt? Did you take him rabbit hunting?

Skip Still: Yes, I was on is my Beagles. It was right at the end of the season, and we had a very good hunt with him.

Ramsey Russell: Can you talk about that hunt? What was it like taking a young man rabbit hunt? A lot of us cut our teeth rabbit hunting or on small game. And back when I was 14 years old, I took every day for the rest of my life for granted. Now you’re my demographic. How did it feel letting those beagle hounds out with that young boy, I’m assuming his family members, and taking him on what might have been his last hunt on Earth. How did it feel?

Skip Still: Well, it was very rewarding at the time. But then when 15 days later, I heard about his demise, it was some decisions we had to make. I had to make some personal decisions. Can I live with this? Can this is going to be an up and down ride. But then I decided, who am I? The parents are dealing with this, the children are dealing with this, certainly I can give up a little bit to take these children, if it affects me tremendously emotionally. It’s also affects me a lot of positive ways too. And it’s not about us. It’s not about Leroy, Richard or myself, it’s about those kids and those parents. And it was a joy to let those beagles out because I love to hear one bark anyway. And seeing the smile on that young man’s face, it was just wonderful.

Ramsey Russell: Had he ever been rabbit hunting before?

Skip Still: I don’t think so. His father was actually a musician in a church and I think he was – probably his mother was not in the picture anymore, so I don’t think he’d been hunting much at all. But he wanted to explore stuff in his final days.

Ramsey Russell: Leroy, were you on that hunt also?

Leroy Martin: No, sir. I wasn’t involved. I mean, I knew the Ponder boy and Brad and I talked about it and probably I was around after he passed away. So I probably came in there about 5 days after that rabbit hunt and got involved. And I got involved with a friend of mine’s son, had osteosarcoma in his leg and we were telling him he was going to get to go on a good hunt. And I just happened to go see him in the hospital and he was taking chemo, it was a while after he had his leg amputated and he was white and his bald head and he was thrown up in a bucket. And I walked in the hospital room and I could not knew he felt awful. And I said, Justin, when you get feeling better, we going hunting somewhere. And I saw a change in him right there when I said that, it was like it picked him up and he set up in the bed and he and I started talking about his hunt he was going on. And I had known this kid ever since he was born, and it made a big impact on me because I saw the difference that the Outdoor Dream Foundation made in his life just by changing his attitude when he was so sick. And Justin passed away when he was 15, I had the opportunity to go on several deer hunt, a hog hunt, a turkey hunt and stuff like that with Justin. And there was not a dry eye in the whole church the day we had his funeral. And like Skip said, it’s up and down for you and it’s not about us and I’ve had the opportunity to hunt with several of these kids and the down part is, you know you’re going to lose some of them. And Justin, the difference I saw in that child in that hospital room is what made me draw so tightly to this organization, because it just turned the whole switch in his life when we started talking about hunting and he was just so sick. And gave him something to think about.

Ramsey Russell: Well, you had known Justin his whole life, so you had probably shared a blind with him before, hadn’t you, Leroy?

Leroy Martin: Yes. Right. Turkey hunted with him when he was a little, probably even before he got sick. I mean, he used to come around and we’d go fishing and stuff together with him and his dad. Yes, sir, I knew him since he was born, and it just impacted. What I saw that it did for his life by getting his mind on something other than cancer, it made a big difference in my life.

Ramsey Russell: I have heard that, and from other people coping with cancer or other trauma, that having something to look forward to has healing powers in and of itself. I’ve heard that before. When you all were sitting in the room, you went up there to see this little boy, Justin, is that when you all hatched the plan right then? Did you all were going to do a hunt? What did you all decide that hunt, that first hunt was going to be? Was it going to be a deer hunt? What was special about that deer hunt?

Leroy Martin: We were going to take him on a deer hunt, we’ve got a place down here that’s probably about an hour from where I live. And it’s a 1200 acre high fence, and the gentleman that owned it would let us bring the kids in there and shoot cull bucks, a good 8 points or something like that. But it was something he didn’t want in there. And that’s what we were going to take Justin on. And he and I sat there and we talked about that thing for about an hour. And it was almost like he wasn’t sick while we were there talking about it. I mean, his mind was on something positive rather than just being on the cancer.

Ramsey Russell: Probably every waking moment that he could think about that’s what he dreamed of, is just that next step, that one good thing. We’re all grown men, a lot of us listening to grown men and we all know Santa Claus is a children’s myth, but boy, when you’re a child, I mean, when I look back on being a child and thinking about Christmas morning, Christmas morning was just afterglow. It was all build up, looking forward to Christmas morning that really got a child most excited. Is it something like that when you start, when some of these children with the Outdoor Dream Foundation begin to start planning these trips. Do you see that similar effect that Santa Claus is coming type effect?

Richard Cranes: Absolutely.

Leroy Martin: Yes. It’s definitely.

Ramsey Russell: Richard, tell me how you got involved with Outdoor Dream Foundation. What is your personal involvement? What led you to this organization?

Richard Cranes: Well, I’m basically married into the family, and we helped just a little bit with the fundraisers and selling them raffle tickets. And as that went on, I got to seeing how powerful his organization was and what it done for kids and families. And you just can’t help but just get pulled in, I mean, it’s amazing the things that we get to see and the joy brings these families. And then the ones that, the people that lose their children, we’ve got memories and lots of these things were, they’re videoed. And you were asking earlier if some of the parents that’s lost their child or they still involved and yes, they are. They come back and help us. Help us with our fundraisers. It’s really a ODF family.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Richard Cranes: And once they’re in there, you’re part of the family.

Ramsey Russell: Well, speaking of family, are all 3 of you all fathers? Do you all have children yourselves? I know it’s kind of a personal question, but I’m assuming you do.

Richard Cranes: No, we do not.

Ramsey Russell: Okay.

Richard Cranes: Other guys do. I’m the childless one.

Ramsey Russell: I got you. Well, I guess, as soon as I asked that question, I was thinking to myself, of course, you got a lot of children, you’ve got a lot of children through this organization.

Richard Cranes: They are.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Leroy Martin: I’ve got one son, and he’s 16 now, and my wife and I adopted him when he was 2 hours old. And that’s the only child we’ve got.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah. Leroy, you told me a pretty profound story about you and that adopted son one time. Is that a story you could share about your kind of understanding about the fragility of life?

Leroy Martin: Yes, sir. I mean, I feel like God put this child in our life and I needed him as much as he needed me, Ramsey. And that’s kind of the way our life has been. And he’s a blessing to me and my wife and we had a tree fall through our house when he was 3 years old. Is that what you talking about?

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Leroy Martin: And the tree landed on me in the bed, and they called the helicopter to come and get me and enroute, the helicopter was called back and said, we don’t need you because we doing a recovery, not a rescue. So I pretty much flatlined out. But anyway, they got me out from under the tree, and I went to the hospital, and my whole left side was crushed. I mean, it was like jello, it was just totally crushed out. And the next morning, my wife asked our son what he thought about daddy being under that tree, and he told his mother, he said, mama, daddy’s going to be fine. And like I said, he was 3 years old at the time. And my wife said, well, how do you know your daddy was going to be fine, son? And he looked at his mom and he said, did you not see Jesus standing at the foot of daddy’s bed? Like I said, he’s a blessing to us. And he told his mama because we had two walls and the roof torn out of the house. And he asked his mama or his mama, when we looked in his baby bed, he didn’t have anything in his baby bed. No debris from the ceiling, no anything, and he told his mama that God had put a bubble around his bed. That’s what protected him.

Ramsey Russell: Well, I tell you what, that’s a lot of contrast. That child of yours having a bubble around his bed like that, so to speak, versus what a lot of these children you all deal with are going through, isn’t it? Life just really ain’t fair.

Leroy Martin: That’s right. I agree with you, 100%. And personally, if somebody come and told me that my son had cancer tomorrow, I would ask God to take that cancer out of his body and put it in mine.

Ramsey Russell: Amen. Well, that’s what hits me so hard. I’ve got my past, I’ve seen light at the end of the tunnel, so to speak, but that’s been a long time ago. And just being honest, every single time, I got 3 children, and on all 3 occasions that doctor handed me that baby, I cried. Because they were just beautiful, little, pure baby, a gift from God handed to me. And it was overwhelming just in contrast to my own personal past. And as a daddy, I worry, but you all be careful when you drive, there’s so many things in the universe I can’t control. I can’t control cancer. I can’t control traffic. I can’t control those outputs. And it makes me feel so terribly overwhelmed. I worry. I’m a parent, I worry. And I think that’s why it hit so hard when you and I had our very brief conversation over breakfast there at the Hampton Inn near, I guess it was Baton Rouge, that it just kind of hit home, it really struck a chord with me that I’ve still been thinking about this conversation and about this program, I really have. You all started in 2004, and I’ve heard of groups like this before. I’ve heard of other foundations that got their place, no doubt, and they’re valuable, no doubt. But were some of the other programs that started that take terminally ill children out on dreamtrips, were they at one time more friendly or more tolerant of hunting and fishing and firearms? And then they changed. Did they become woke, or were they always that way out the gate?

Skip Still: I do not know the answer to that. I can tell you, when we started, Isaac had asked Make a Wish. And I don’t want to say anything negative about that foundation, because that is a wonderful foundation, and we work together very well. And a lot of our children go both, going to Make a Wish and the Outdoor Dream, but Make a Wish didn’t allow guns. So that was kind of our impetus to get started. Does that answer your question a little bit?

Ramsey Russell: I guess it does. I was just wondering if some of them foundations had started with firearms, recreational activities, and then changed patterns because of political influence or if they just went out the gate against it, because of the “violent” nature of it all, relative to what they’re dealing with. Because let’s face it, it’s not just a lot of us hunters and fishermen and people that were raised in outdoor for generations, we have children, some of those children become terminally ill, and maybe they don’t want to go to Disney or New York City, maybe they want to go hunting and fishing. That’s how we were all raised. And I don’t know, I guess Make a Wish means make a wish. I’m not picking on that organization, they’re a great organization. I’m just saying, it just seems to me it ought to be unlimited. I was just curious had that thought, did they start one way and swip, or were they always that way? Just a matter of fact. And kind of what I’m thinking is I wonder if there’s some kind of government funding or something that some kind of purse strings that might be attached to a certain no gun policy.

The Power of Connection Through Outdoor Adventures.

But no, we were pro-gun then and we’re pro-gun, pro-hunting now and the same with them. What we have found that’s a little bit different about our organization is it’s not a one and done. It’s not this big hunt and it’s over with. We try our best to mentor these children.

Skip Still: No. I know of several organizations very similar to ours one out of Arkansas, and some of them do get some funding through a university and that type thing. But no, we were pro-gun then and we’re pro-gun, pro-hunting now and the same with them. What we have found that’s a little bit different about our organization is it’s not a one and done. It’s not this big hunt and it’s over with. We try our best to mentor these children. We’ll have fishing events where we bring in people from all over the state. One of my favorite young people ever was Corey Kubeco. And I will demonstrate how that happened with somebody that lived in Texas. I was a wildlife biologist by trade, I’m retired now. And Corey, we got him on a bear hunt in North Carolina. And a really fine. He was our first hunter to North Carolina. His mother asked me on the way up, I was driving him, and she asked me, said, Skip, I need to talk to a preacher. She was having some trouble in her lives and all that. And we were going to Hyde County, North Carolina. That’s about as rural as you can get. And I told her –

Ramsey Russell: It’s still hard to find a cell phone signal in Hyde County.

Skip Still: Yes. And anyway, we were there and stuff was just, going along smoothly with the groups we were with. And then something happened where a dog got hurt and we were just standing up by the road and these other people came by and they said, we’re from Mattamuskeet Ventures and we would like to take you all on this hunt. We would like to invite you all to Mattamuskeet Ventures. My first thing was, no, we’ve already got all these other people. But Corey said, no, I want to go with them. And we ended up on Mattamuskeet Ventures. And I watched that boy grow up, they made a man. He didn’t want his mother to go with him, he was just wonderful.

Ramsey Russell: How old was he, Skip?

Skip Still: He was like 12.

Ramsey Russell: Okay.

Skip Still: Jim Zumbo showed up. You know the famous Jim Zumbo?

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Skip Still: So he got to hunt with Zumbo. But the most exciting thing that happened the next morning at breakfast, this guy said this really nice prayer and I asked him who he was and turns out he was Billy Graham’s grandson and he was hunting there with us. So Corey got to meet him and he talked to Corey’s mother, and Corey since passed away. But the last time I talked to Corey, he was on a church bus and he wanted to be a youth pastor when he grew up. And so it changed and his mother, it changed both their lives. But to tell you how it kind of went full circle, people asked, well, how did you all mentor him in Texas? Well, since I was a biologist, I was on the Southeastern Bear Committee with another fellow that was a biologist in Texas. And he was able to get with Corey and do some stuff with him also. So we have so many connections throughout the country now that not only we take them on these hunts, we also mentor them. But the thing that I will always remember, Corey’s mother wrote us a letter and she said the Outdoor Dream has put the smile back on my young man’s face and put the will to live back in his heart. And I’ll never forget that.

Ramsey Russell: Skip, when you talk about going on a Hyde county bear hunt now was this sitting in a blind or was this showing off Hyde county bear hunting behind dogs?

Skip Still: Well, we did both. We sat in the blind, in fact we saw a bear about the size of a Volkswagen but it was too far to shoot and we’ve actually, he killed that almost when it was getting on alligator refuge. He shot the bear running in front of dogs and made an excellent shot. We’ve been able to take kids to North Carolina bear hunting that’s got to hunt with Dolly Parton’s first cousin who owns the record for 880lbs world record bear. So these kids get to go with some – I mean they’ve hunted with Larry Csonka and Sid Bream and just a lot of different celebrities.

Ramsey Russell: You talk about mentoring these children and it takes a whole another level, it’s one thing if a young person has a terminally ill diagnosis, so all things equal, maybe they aren’t going to live for the rest of their lives. And as Leroy said, taking these young people talking about going on a hunt, when you get out of this hospital, we going to get ice cream, we going to go deer hunt, we going to do something amazing and that all of a sudden it’s something they can sink their teeth into. But you start talking about mentoring Skip, that’s a whole another level. It’s like one of my favorite and I can’t quote the Bible so nobody freak out. But honest to God, since I was a young man myself, one of my favorite all time scriptures was from Hebrews 11, “Talking about faith being the substance of things, things that you hope for”. Faith is the substance of things hope for. And I mean, we hope that these young people that are participating in Outdoor Dream Foundation are going to beat the rap and they are going to live to be old men like ourselves and they are going to live productive lives. And boy, I mean, now, instead of just going on this hunt, now they get exposed to maybe being a wildlife biologist or maybe being a youth minister one day, it starts playing through. Have any of you all had some stories where they didn’t die a week or two later they went on for years and they actually started that mentoring or some of that life started playing out, and that makes sense? Did they live and beat the rap still out there going? Did this mentoring and the contact they had with you all ministry put them on a path?

Skip Still: Well, I’ll get her started, but then I certainly don’t have the answers. But Ramsay, several of them, several of them have lived and I guess the oldest ones are about 31 or 32 now. And they’ve done real well. The mentoring, to me, it helps the children to be around other children that are facing situations similar situation. But to see the parents get together like we have fishing, rodeos and things, the parents will get together and talk or we’ve had camping trips where they’ve got together and talk. And it’s not only for the children when it comes to that, it’s for the parents, too. And you asked a question earlier, and I want to say this before I forget it about, why does a child want to go out and kill something that’s facing death himself? And somebody asked me that question one time in a bank line because they knew I was with Outdoor Dreams and there was happened to be a psychiatrist standing in line behind us, we were talking about it and she told me, and I’ll always remember this, too, she said, I think I know the answer. And I said, please share it. And she said, these children in youth have very little things that they could control in their lives, but they can control this. They can control when they’re out hunting or fishing, and that just to me, that explained it.

Ramsey Russell: I think it goes a long way to explain, there’s so much in life none of us can control, but they can take just a little control of their lives that way, they can deal with it on their terms. Makes it very relatable that way.

Skip Still: Right.

Ramsey Russell: Leroy, what about some of your favorite memories of times with parents and their terminally ill child? Can you recall any of your other memories besides Justin?

Leroy Martin: Sure. One of my favorite kids other than Justin was a kid named Ryan Cockrell. And Ryan was a 9^th grader, and he was playing baseball for the high school baseball team in Greenwood, South Carolina. And I met him and his daddy, told him, said, son, tell Mr. Leroy your story. And he said, Mr. Leroy, what happened was I was pitching my first high school ball game. And he said, my first pitch was a ball. And he said, my second pitch, I blew it past him and it was a strike. And my third pitch, the guy hit the ball back and the ball hit him in the temple. And they said that after they video, watch the video of it, that the ball hit Ryan doing about 100 miles an hour when it hit him in the temple. And Ryan was paralyzed and he was in a wheelchair. And one day that I mentioned earlier, the guy that’s got the high deer fence down here, and he called Brad and he said, Brad, I’ve got a buck down here that’s injured. And he said, he’s standing in the creek. And he said, he’s been in the creek for 24 hours and he won’t move. He said, can you all get one of the kids down here to take this buck? And we were like, well, we’ll try to get Ryan down there. When we got Ryan’s daddy, and Ryan showed up that Monday afternoon and they were going to film it, and Ryan was in his wheelchair. And the film crew said, well, the sun isn’t right. So what we did, Brad and I picked up Ryan in his wheelchair and we crossed the creek and we set him on the other side of the creek there, and everything was good. And Ryan took the deer, and we got down into the deer, it took Ryan in his wheelchair down there to the deer, and he picked up the horn. And I think it was a 12 point, and it had like a 20 inch spread, 22 inch spread. And he looked at me and he looked at his daddy and he said, I think I’ve killed one bigger than grandpa.

Ramsey Russell: God, what a great story.

Leroy Martin: That just sticks with me like it was yesterday. His illness wasn’t an illness, it was the injury. Because he told me that when he was telling me the story that Dr. Bucci was a brain doctor here in Anderson. And Ryan told me, he said, Dr. Bucci told me later on that I was supposed to die on the field that day. And like, I said, he’s still in a wheelchair and he’s paralyzed on his, I think it’s his left side. But I’ll never forget the smile on his face when he looked at me and his daddy and he said, I think I’ve killed one bigger than grandpa.

Ramsey Russell: We’ve talked about North Carolina bears, we’ve talked about whitetail deer, we talked about rabbits. What are some of the other hunts around the country that you all have taken some of these children on?

Leroy Martin: Go ahead, Skip. I’ll tell you this. Justin, on his big trip that we paid for, he went to New Mexico and he took a 6 by 6 elk and a black bear while he was out there. And we had one kid and he said he survived. He had leukemia, Linwood, and I can’t remember Linwood’s last name, but we sent Linwood to Alaska and he killed a 9.5ft grizzly bear. Skip, you want to chime in on some of the hunts that you’ve –

A Grizzly Bear Hunt: Fulfilling a Young Man’s Dream.

Another young man that got hurt playing JV football, his goal in life was to kill a grizzly bear. And he went to the same place that the other young man had went and I went with him and we flew, we were in the middle of nowhere.

Skip Still: Well, yeah, let me say a few and then let’s let Richard tell about the western hunts because he’s been more involved with those. When Leroy said grizzly bear, that brought up a good memory of mine. Another young man that got hurt playing JV football, his goal in life was to kill a grizzly bear. And he went to the same place that the other young man had went and I went with him and we flew, we were in the middle of nowhere. This young man had, he was a quadriplegic, could not move his arms, could not move his legs, the only thing he could move was his neck and his hands. In fact, Lars met us at the airport when he heard the guy, that this young man had been hurt playing football. And we took him out and we got him a grizzly bear in Alaska. And that was one of the toughest things I’ve ever tried to get because it was hard, but we got him one. But a lot of the western kids, they want to come east and a lot of them want to get an alligator. And then Richard talked about the west in a minute. But I will tell a little bit story about these gators. One, I’m retired biologist, one of the retired game wardens, a big man now. He’s a nuisance control person for alligators after he retired. And he has gotten over a thousand gators. But he takes these kids and he catches, he nooses the gator, and the kids and their parents bring that gator up. Gator’s fully alive now. And then he helps him. It’s very safe the way he does it. He helps him to tie that gator up, and then the kid and his parents sit on that gator’s back. And I asked him one time, I said, Chip, why do you do that? Why just pull it up and let them do whatever they go do to it? And he said, you feel that child’s heartbeat through his back when you’re sitting there. And if that child doesn’t make it, I want those parents to always remember that heartbeat and then feeling that heartbeat. So, the ones out west want to get a gator. And Richard, why don’t you talk a little bit about what they get out west?

Richard Cranes: Most of the kids, when they fill out their application, they put in what they would like for their dream hunt. And most of them pick elk, some mule deer, some bears. But most of them go out west for a real nice elk. And we have partnered with outfitters from New Mexico, we have a lot of them in Wyoming, that’s where the majority of them go to Wyoming. And while they’re there, they do get to whitetail hunt some, and mule deer and antelope, almost forgot antelope. And then they do a little bit of sightseeing all while they’re there. And we do go out there in the spring for a couple of trips to hunt the turkeys out there. I’ve been out there one time, and it’s a beautiful place, and the kids love it.

Ramsey Russell: Richard, where do you think they get – like, a lot of kids from down the Southeast, what inspires them or where they get the idea to go out west and shoot elk, mule deer and pronghorn antelope and things of that nature, would you think?

Richard Cranes: Probably from just watching some of our shows or watching some of the shows on the hunting channels, because that’s kind of the ultimate North American game is the elk. We’ve had a few kids want to get a moose, but those are kind of hard to get those tags. And then now we did have one kid, he wanted to shoot a buffalo, so we’ve had a few take buffalo out West.

Ramsey Russell: What’s the hardest animal to put some of these participants, some of these Outdoor Dream Foundation beneficiaries. What’s some of the hardest hunt to put them on? I’m just wondering if there is a 15, 16 year old kids got a lot of life in them normally. But what would be some for the condition they’re in. What would be some of the most challenging hunts they would try to attempt?

Richard Cranes: Probably something that, they would really have to get back in the backcountry to get. We’ve been really fortunate with some of the animals like sheep. We had a kid, they were coming down from the hills, down onto some pivots and feeding in the fall, which they don’t normally come down that far. But kid wanted a sheep and one of my brother in law’s friends, he’d been waiting years to pull a tag and he finally drew a tag on a big horn sheep. He donated it to one of our kids.

Ramsey Russell: What state would that have been? Because some of those sheep draws are once in a lifetime.

Richard Cranes: Yeah. This was in north northeast Wyoming. Up around Sundance, I believe. And I think he was a game warden, he’d waited a long time to draw a tag.

Ramsey Russell: Probably his whole life.

Leroy Martin: Right.

Richard Cranes: Yeah. Brad called him up and said, hey, I got a kid wanting a big orange sheep, and he’s like, how is it to get a tag? He said, it’s kind of hard. He said, but I tell you what, he said, I’ve been waiting for years to draw one, he said, I drew one this year, he said, I’ll give it to him.

Ramsey Russell: My goodness gracious. What do you think his involvement was for that? I mean, do you have any idea what would compel somebody to donate a once in a lifetime draw like that or twice in a lifetime maybe to an unknown child?

Richard Cranes: Well, my brother in law had a relationship with him through getting tags and lining up hunts and all. And so, he knew what we done and knew how hard it was. And I mean it was just that given of a person to give that up. And I mean, he probably got more out of giving that to one of these kids than he would have got out of the pleasure of harvesting that animal itself.

Ramsey Russell: I can see that.

Leroy Martin: Can I chime in on that?

Ramsey Russell: Yeah, please.

Leroy Martin: One of the things that I’ve noticed it. I was in Texas one time and we went to the deer show and I was asking people if they would donate stuff for our fundraiser. And I used to be on the Ducks Unlimited committee. And it’s kind of like getting teeth pulled to get something for Ducks Unlimited. But I found out that when you say, well, we raising money for a terminal ill killed kid that’s got life threatening disease or illness for them to go on hunting, fishing trip, people open up their heart a whole lot quicker than they will for like a Ducks Unlimited.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Leroy Martin: And I’ve experienced that first-hand. We was in Texas and we went to this place, that guy did metal art. And we stopped on the side of the road and I told my wife, I said, we going to stop, I’m going to ask him if he’ll donate something for the organization. And when I got out, I said, do you ever donate anything? And he said, yeah, but I’m donated out for the year. And I told him about the Outdoor Dream Foundation and he looked at me and he said, that’s for terminal kids? And I said, yes, sir. And when I did, he told me, he said, will you go around my lot and you pick out anything you want, it’s yours.

Ramsey Russell: Who won that trip? Who went on that hunt?

Leroy Martin: This was metal art. We did that at our fundraiser dinner. And that was another thing when I was out there at the deer festival they had there in Houston, I had guys, I’d ask them about a deer hunt and again they would say, well, we’ve got all our deer hunts are booked up this year. But one guy said, but I tell you what, I got a buffalo hunt, I’ll donate a buffalo hunt. It just means a whole lot more to people when you involving a kid that probably is either going to have a lifetime full of heartaches or he’s not going to live to be an old man like we are.

Ramsey Russell: What’s it like? What are the parents like on these trips to mamas and daddies? I mean, what is their general demeanor? Are they hunters themselves? What is it like having a parent in the truck or on the trip or on the hike with the child or in camp?

Leroy Martin: Some of them are, some of them are not. One of the fondest memories I have on a waterfowl hunt is we got a place over in Georgia, it’s called Skeeter Ranch. And what they do is they release mallards. But the man is kind enough that every year at the end of the season, he lets all our ODF kids come in and do and hunt and I had a child with me in the blind and he had already had four brain surgeries and his brain surgeries, I got to share my story about the tree falling on me. And his mother was in the blind with us and he was going to leave on Monday to go back to Duke University to have his 5^th brain surgery. And when I got home that night, his mom sent me the sweetest message on messenger about how much that she saw a change in her son’s in that blind that day and that she was so blessed that he was paired with me because I had had a life threatening injury and he was going through the same kind of a thing except his was cancer and mine was a 91ft popper tree.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Leroy Martin: And his mother saw what was going on and what I did was usually they get to shoot 4 mallards over there. And what I always do is I try to talk the kid into letting mama shoot the 4^th one.

Ramsey Russell: Heck yeah.

Leroy Martin: That was the first time she had ever shot anything. But she shot old mallard drake out there. And it means a lot to them that succeed that there’s somebody other than the doctors and all and then the immediate family that actually cares about their child.

Ramsey Russell: We talked about this kind of before we mic’d up. And what hit me so hard about this program was Leroy, when you said, hey, Mr. Russell, we just think maybe you’d want to climb in a blind with some of these people, it grabbed me because I don’t know how I’d feel about that. You know what I’m saying? I think about that, I’m thinking, some of the best times I’ve spent with my own kids were in a duck blind. And what if I knew one of them wasn’t going to be around? I mean, the child may die, some of them did die and they’re gone onto the happy hunting ground. But mom and daddy’s left behind and what a great – and that’s what this ministry speaks to me so much about, it’s not just the kid, it’s not just the mentoring, it’s not just giving him something to look forward to. It’s not putting a card on in the stick, something for him to dig deep and live for, it’s if the child dies, mom and daddy have a really good memory, going to shoot in that mallard duck for the first time with her son. I mean, that hits home. And that’s really what stuck in my craw and I thought about so much after our conversation at Delta Waterfowl Expo was how would I feel in a blind sharing that moment with that. I think it would be an honor, but it would also be as a dad, it’d be terribly overwhelming, you know what I’m saying? Emotionally, it’d be overwhelming. It breaks my heart to think about it is what I’m trying to say. And I would love to participate in something like this. This is why it’s so important to have this topic talked about. I’ve always said life short get ducks. Well, it’s shorter for some than others. You know what I’m saying?

Leroy Martin: Yes, sir.

Ramsey Russell: What are some other waterfowl hunts you all been on?

Leroy Martin: Most of the kids that we get involved with, really, they want to go do the big game stuff. But yeah, Skip was telling me earlier today that he’s got a kid now that’s wanting to go on a waterfowl hunt and he’s trying to find a good waterfowl hunt for that.

Ramsey Russell: Well, maybe somebody listeners got one. I know somebody. Somebody’s got one.

Skip Still: Ramsay Several states. South Carolina is one, North Carolina’s one, Georgia’s got a law and maybe Wyoming, if the legislators have passed laws where we can get tags for these children and youth that a lot of that other people have to draw for. And one of those is the swans up in North Carolina. We’ve had several of our kids that have gone hunting in North Carolina for the swans. And those things are big.

Ramsey Russell: They’re big bird. Big, beautiful bird.

Skip Still: Right. And another question you asked that I want to get in on is the families, the parents. All of us are super energized and want to do the best for our children. But what I have found and a lot of our kids are losing muscle mass, a lot of the young men have dashain muscular dystrophy. And I’ve seen their parents, they go way beyond the extra mile, they live for those children. They give up so much for those children. And I admire them for that.  They know what may be in the future with the shins, they know pretty well exactly what’s in the future unless there’s a miracle. But they’re there and they push and they go and they get cut up and briar bit and everything else, but they put those kids on their back and they go. Some of the best parents I’ve ever met are Outdoor Dream parents.

Ramsey Russell: That’s a great story. Here’s a question I’ve got is, hunting don’t equate to killing. It’s a full blown experience. I mean, boy, I tell you what, a lot of the duck hunting I do, nationwide, worldwide, if your sense of happiness boils down to just a heavy strap, you’re going to be unhappy a lot of times you’ve got to enjoy the people and the place and the whole drama and pageantry of duck hunting. Because like I read old market hunter era log book entry way back before Migratory Bird Treaty Act, a buddy of mine name, Ryan Graves showed me, man went out duck hunt one day and he didn’t see nothing. He put a little more crudely than that, didn’t see blank and that’s duck hunt, that’s the nature of it. So here’s a question I’ve got. How important is it to the recipients of Outdoor Dream Foundation or their parents that they actually pull the trigger and actually kill a deer, kill a sheep or kill a duck? I mean, how important is that in hindsight? Is it a failed hunt if the child goes to Wyoming and doesn’t kill a mule deer or go somewhere and doesn’t kill a swan? Is it a failed hunt or is it still a treasured moment?

Richard Cranes: It’s a treasured moment. Any moment out in the field is a good moment.

Ramsey Russell: Absolutely. Have you all ever had that happen where somebody went on a hunt, it just didn’t play out, it just wasn’t in the cards?

Richard Cranes: And a lot of these kids, they’ve been places and the guides and all have done their prep work and all. And a lot of times it’s 100%, but it’s not always 100%. And we let them know that. And especially on some of these mentoring things to where we’re just going hunting here and there. And there’s not a lot of scouting and prep done, so we let them know if they don’t get something, that’s okay. My wife, she said, the kids a lot of times they handle it better than the guides do.

Ramsey Russell: I bet they do. Has a child ever gone that far and missed because I’ve seen some grown men miss before.

Richard Cranes: Oh, yeah.

Skip Still: They may miss. But I can tell you these children, because I know when I was their age, I would get buck fever and get so excited. One thing we’ve all noticed that, these young people, before they make their shot, they are never excited. They’re calm, most of them are calm, we’ve had one or two with other difficulties have got excited, but most of them are just calm as they can be. But after the shot you have never seen kids so excited in your life. It awakens your heart in there, man, it is just wonderful.

Richard Cranes: Yes. Especially the ones that have never really hunted or shot a gun.

Skip Still: Right.

Ramsey Russell: Well, speaking of that, Skip, Leroy, Richard, I mean, you talked about the mama killing her first duck on this trip. Have there been some of your youth hunters kill their first animal ever on these trips?

Richard Cranes: Yeah, absolutely. And the majority of them, it’s their first hunting experience.

Ramsey Russell: And I guess a lot of the mentoring goes into just getting prepared for this mentally, emotionally trigger pulling, all that good stuff. You all go out to shooting range and practice a little bit.

Richard Cranes: Yes, we try to take all the kids if they’re local. We got people, hunting clubs, people’s got shooting setups. I’ve been already working with some this year. And if they live somewhere else, we try to get somebody in their area to get them, acclimated to shooting or around guns before they get to their hunting destination, which once they get there, they always shoot again. And the guy wants to know they’re comfortable and relaxed and we got to check the guns and all that good stuff. So we try to get them prepared.

Ramsey Russell: Fantastic.

Leroy Martin: I think one of the things that you kind of touched on, Ramsey, was a lot of the hunt is about spending time with that parent and that child.

Ramsey Russell: Absolutely.

Leroy Martin: I mean, that to me is one of the things that really – Because 99% of all the times at least one parent goes with the child on these hunts. And I think you know it and a lot of us know it Skip and all, we know it. It’s called hunting, it’s not killing, and that’s what we try to promote that with the kids, too.

Ramsey Russell: Well, one of the most important lessons I learned, Leroy, as a daddy myself, especially when they were babies, they were young, knee high, belt high kids spell love, T.I.M.E. That’s it. It ain’t about the catching, it’s about spending time. It ain’t about the shooting, it’s about being at camp with their mom and their daddy or the people and their friends, it’s TIME, that is how love is spelled to a child. And I think to a lot of us.

Leroy Martin: Well, 25 years ago, maybe west been 30 years ago, probably, I had a guy at the Buck-A-Rama show in Atlanta tell me one time, and this kind of resonates for me is, you take your kid hunting, you won’t have to hunt your kid.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Leroy Martin: And that kind of goes on. The kids that we do with this Outdoor Dream Foundation is, it’s not only about the kids. It’s about the parents and other things that’s involved. And it makes a whole difference. I mean, I’ve been blessed by 100% more than I know any kid I’ve ever took on a hunt. But being able to share that blind time with them and the camaraderie ship with a child that’s got a terminal illness or disease.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Leroy Martin: And that goes a long way from me and I’m sure with everybody else on it that we’re talking to today and other members of the Outdoor Dream Foundation that get involved with this.

Ramsey Russell: You touched on a real good point there, Leroy. The best way to help oneself is to help others. That goes all the way back to the Bible. That’s just who we are. You need to help yourself, help somebody else. And that’s what you three gentlemen and all the other volunteers and organizers of the Outdoor Dream Foundation do. How has helping these children changed each of your lives? Who are you now, Skip, Richard, Leroy, different than what you might have been back in 2004 or 2005.

Skip Still: Boy, I’ve tried to answer that one first. It makes you very much appreciate our own health. It makes you appreciate our children’s health, but it also makes you appreciate the drive these children have and the drive that their parents have and how they don’t give up and they seem to turn to each other and we turn to them, too. I think Leroy or somebody said that, we get more out of it than they do. And I think a lot of times we do it. You can’t be self centered, you got to be about other people. And these kids, parents are just wonderful people. And they have been such an inspiration, I know, to all of us. But I can say, especially to me, I think they’ve taught me how to be a better parent, a better grandparent, because I’ve watched them.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah. What about you, Leroy?

Leroy Martin: Well, if you can’t get an inspiration from what these kids going through and what their parents are going through and how these parents nurtured their children, just going through this stuff, it’s just an inspiration for me. I mean, I have things that, I guess we all have aches and pains, but then you stop and think, well, let’s think about these kids that’s going through this. And that’s just inspiration for me. And it gets me up out of the bed going every morning. And like I said, when that tree fell on me, my whole left side was crushed. But just to see these kids and know that they may not be here within 2 weeks or whatever, if you don’t get inspiration from that, then there’s something bad wrong with you.

Ramsey Russell: Richard, how has participating in Outdoor Dream Foundation and helping others, how has it helped you?

Drawing Strength from the Resilience of These Kids.

It’s very rewarding. I mean, and we get kind of bogged down with it sometimes. I mean, there’s a lot of stuff that we juggle with working and getting in these trips and taking their vacation time to go on these things. But it’s very rewarding.

Richard Cranes: It’s just like the other guys said, it makes your appreciate life more, makes me appreciate the, I guess my health growing up and now that I’m an adult. And like I said, me and my wife don’t have any children. I said, I won’t ever get married, and I said I was never going to have children. But I met Ms. Jones and she changed things there. And so I settled down when I was about 40, and then we got involved with the Outdoor Dream Foundation and it kind of just gives you a purpose in life to know that there’s these people out there that have a need that they don’t know they need, but once it’s offered and you get the ball rolling, it just brings so much to their lives, to their kids lives, to get them out of the house where, I mean, if it wasn’t for us, a lot of these people or the child would be probably just sitting in the house waiting on their next chemo treatment or next doctor appointment. And they had no means to get them outside and do anything. And then when they’re with us, they’re like, hey, we’re going on this hunt. And it’s like I said before, we make them feel like a normal kid. And just getting to see all that, it’s just a part of me and my wife’s life. It’s very rewarding. I mean, and we get kind of bogged down with it sometimes. I mean, there’s a lot of stuff that we juggle with working and getting in these trips and taking their vacation time to go on these things. But it’s very rewarding. And like the guys were saying that sometimes you don’t feel like, hey, I’m tired, or you got ache or pain or something, then you think like, what’s these kids going through? Listen to me whining, suck it up and be tough like that.

Ramsey Russell: That’s a great point. It really is all things relative. You bring up a good point about your wife and the time and the sacrifice, Richard, that everybody’s going through to help these young people and how involved – Because a lot of times when one spouse gets involved hard and heavy into something, well, I mean, that’s part of being a partnership, the other spouse is necessarily involved. How involved are all of you all spouses involved with this program for you all to be so active as you are? I don’t guess they’re just sitting at home.

Skip Still: I can tell you my wife is put up with a lot. But let me also say, because I don’t want this thing to end without me saying this. The Joneses, there would not be such an organization if it wasn’t for the Jones family. And many people when we mentioned Brad or mentioned Coach Jones, they don’t know who they are. But Coach Jones is the movie Radio was made after the relationship that Coach Jones and Radio had.

Ramsey Russell: Tell that story because I’m not sure I’m following. Are we talking about Mr. Brad Jones?

Skip Still: No, we talking about Brad’s daddy.

Ramsey Russell: Okay. Tell that story about Radio.

Skip Still: Okay, you tell it, Richard, because you know it the best.

Richard Cranes: All right. Okay. Let me ask you a question. Have you ever seen the movie Radio?

Ramsey Russell: I don’t guess I have, but I’m going to watch it on Netflix soon.

Richard Cranes: Okay. My father in law was a high school coach here at T.L Hanna High School in Anderson his whole life till he retired when he was a JV coach at a junior high, it was kind of a rough kind of section of town, and there was a young mentally challenged man that lived in the neighborhood that would come over and he would observe them, during JV practice and all. And my Father in law, he motioned this young man to come over and he was kind of shy and stayed away. And finally one day he got him to come over and boy could barely talk and the reason he got his name Radio was because he would ramble around the neighborhood, he always had a transistor radio to his ear, listening to music and talking to it. And so that’s how I got his nickname. And then they gave him a little job there with the JV team, kind of like a trainer. And then he grew with the team. And then my father in law went on to coach varsity ball at the high school. Well, I don’t know when he started coming to school, but Radio would actually get on the bus, I’m sure he was probably grown by then. He would get on a public school bus and come to the school and he had a job and I think in the cafeteria a little bit, but he would just walk around the campus and hang out during the day. And then when football practice would start, well, he was right there with him. He traveled with him and he just become a staple here in Anderson. And every year to like the parade, he’d lead the parade. And then when football season was out, he would come out at the basketball games and do the halftime show sometimes. But there was different articles and all in the newspaper over the years where there was a freelance sports writer. I think he was living in Charleston at the time, Gary Smith. He picked up a paper and read this story. And so he called my father in law and asked him, said, hey, I read the stories, I’d love to come up, do a story on you all. And he said, I sell my stories to different magazines and all. So he come up, done a story on them and Sports Illustrated picked it up and they were the featured article on Sports Illustrated like 23 years ago. And then after the Sports Illustrated article come out, the phone started ringing off the hook. People wanting the movie rights. So that’s how all that came to be. And several years later, there were some writers came and they got it all together. And it was Tollin’s and Roberts Productions, I believe was a production company that put it all together. But so they made a movie about my father in law and Radio. Ed Harris played my father in law and Cuba Gooding Jr. Played radio.

Ramsey Russell: Wow. I’m going to watch that soon. How does that story tie into you all story Outdoor Dream Foundation?

Richard Cranes: Okay. So after the movie came out, there’s a lot of media attention and all. So they use that and some of the proceeds that came from it to kick off to get the Outdoor Dream Foundation started.

Ramsey Russell: Okay. Fantastic.

Richard Cranes: And we say Radio was the first Outdoor Dream kid.

Skip Still: Right. And Coach Jones, really, he made so many friends across the country, famous announcers and all that. And all of them now donate a signed wine bottle or sign football or something like that. It all started with Coach Jones, he used his notoriety for good. He’s one of the most unselfish people I’ve ever met. And Brad and Suzanne, the rest of the family as fallen right into that. So they used it for good and we can all learn a lesson from that.

Ramsey Russell: Fantastic. Tell me how can the listener participate? What are the different ways listeners can participate in Outdoor Dream Foundation?

Richard Cranes: They can go to our, we have a website, Outdoordream.org or they can go to our Facebook page, the Outdoor Dream on Facebook. And there’s a donate button, they can set up a monthly donation. They can do a one time donation if anybody’s got trips or hunting trips, hunting equipment. I mean, we use everything and anything. We may put the stuff in a raffle or we may use it on a hunt. So we’re open to any type of donation or contribution that you can give. And that’s how we’ve done. We’ve just networked through people like yourself and all the other connections we’ve made. And the good Lord, it’s amazing the connections that we’ve made in our network of people and how generous they’ve been that pulls this whole thing together. We’re still 100% volunteer, there’s no paid employees high. 90% of the money goes directly to the kids and their trips and everything that funds it. So the whole thing has been blessed beyond means and it just keeps growing.

Leroy Martin: Well, one thing I’ll chime in on that is probably 19 years ago I was telling you about Linwood going on his grizzly bear hunt in Alaska. I know, Brad told me that trip cost $10,000 to get him up there and get the tags and all for that bear hunt.

Ramsey Russell: It’s probably a whole lot more than that right now.

Leroy Martin: Yes, like I said, that’s been 19 years ago. And we’ve managed to put it together because that’s what he wanted to do. He didn’t want to go shoot an elk, he wanted to go to Alaska and shoot a grizzly. And like I said, it was $10,000 back then. And that’s kind of where we’re at. The fundraising and all, it goes to pay for those hunts, that’s what it’s all about.

Ramsey Russell: All volunteer, no paid employees. And I’m guessing that depending on the fundraising, depends on how much and for who you can do. How many kids a year you can take on this trip? How many applicants do you have a year?

Richard Cranes: Prior to COVID and now we’re doing about 35 to 40 dream trips. And that’s what I call a dream trip is most time, like I said, most of them go to Wyoming for an elk, and then some of them take antelope and maybe a mule deer. And our biggest expense right now because we’ve partnered with so many people, is just airfare and car rentals and taxidermy. But the majority of the accommodations, the guides, sometimes the tags, those are all donated by these lodges out in Wyoming.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah. Skip, you’ve been around, Leroy, you’ve been around since 2004, you all were some of the original board members. Where do you want to go from here? You all been around now, shoot, 20 years. What’s the future for Outdoor Dream Foundation?

Skip Still: We hope to get bigger, and we hope to get better, and we hope to take more youth. We have never turned down a qualified youth, and there have been times we had to borrow money to keep it going. So, we’re proud of what we’ve done, but I hope we’re prouder in the future. And we need some younger people to take it over. And Leroy always mentioned Linwood a lot, and you asked earlier about some of the kids grow up and help. And Linwood, his last name’s Yoder Mennonite. And Linwood has helped tremendously. He has helped build blinds, deer blinds, duck blinds, he has helped do all kinds of stuff, and several of these youth have done that. So we’re hoping that some of them may can take up the mantra and go forward and make us even better, because they’ve lived it.

Ramsey Russell: Well, folks, I appreciate you all, Mr. Leroy Martin, Richard Carnes, Skip Still, I really appreciate you all’s time to save to explain it this thing to us. And folks, you all been listening to my buddies, the Outdoor Dream Foundation. Thank you all for listening to this episode of Mojo’s Duck Season Somewhere. I’ve always said life’s short get ducks, but it’s just a stark reminder that life’s shorter for some than others. And boy, what about these dream trips for kids that need it the most? See you next time.

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