The General’s Habitat Managemen‪t‬

Ramsey Russell: I’m your host Ramsey Russell, join me here to listen to those conversations. It is duck season somewhere. Welcome back. I feel at the confluence of the red black river Catahoula parish Louisiana. We’re about three months before duck season and I am sitting with our guest for the past several weeks many of you have in boxed and written and asked about the legendary, The Iconic Warren Coco of Go Devil Motors reasoning from baton rouge Louisiana. How are you today, Warren?

Warren Coco: I’m doing great man.

Ramsey Russell: We’re going to change direction man. I’ll tell you what, I heard a lot about the Gator country stories with the alligators and the Guard balls, the Gar patties last and again, y’all hand catching that 14 ft alligator. I heard a lot about that but I’m going to change the record. We’re right here at one of you camps in Catahoula and a beautiful property, nice camp house. And I’m going to start off today asking you about above your bedroom door there’s an army helmet with five stars. What is that? What’s that about?

Warren Coco: My members here we bought this property. I kind of took the bull by the horns and ran with it as far as management and getting everything done, and they saw how aggressive I was, how I want to make this place better. And early on in my life, I worked for other paper by the time I was 20 years old, I started my own business, I was directing orders after that, and they just nicknamed me the General. So one of my friends got that hat the guy’s wife divided that army helmet and they put some stars on it, hung that over my bedroom door.

Ramsey Russell: I think it fits you perfectly, I’ve been around him now a long time. We’ve eaten, we told stories. We’ve let you shared so many ideas. We’ve looked at your habitat. I hear you on the phone, directing habitat stuff going on elsewhere and talking to your employees down at Go Devil and best I can tell you got three dozen employees and thousands of acres of nice duck habitat, 40 duck holes. And you are, since I have met you, you have been on the goat. It’s like, it’s not a second a waste of time and what I’m wondering, back in your early days when he was a very young man working for other people before you started working for yourself. Did you have them personality traits? Are you born with it? Did you grow into it?

Warren Coco: I was born with mechanical abilities, but I wasn’t born with Imagine people and speaking to people. I can remember when first going to shows I was very intimidated to talk to customers. It was like I was, I would have a hard time speaking and now all I do all day long and speak. I talk, I’m the guy, I’m the Go to guy. Customer has a problem and I got thousands of customers and guys got an engine problem or an engine issue something they call me and I get on the phone and so man, I don’t know I was going to talk to you. I said who do you think you’re going to talk to anybody can help you better than I can, and I can give them the right answer the first time. Well, really fire me up. Somebody will call me and say, look I’ve been reading on the internet “Time out buddy. Time out”. Do not go to the internet for information on product. I said, if you got a product like this mechanical product, you call the manufacturer and find somebody there that can help you. They got so many experts on the internet and no zip all these chat room, websites stuff. I read I’ve never posted one syllable on a chat room. I’m not registered any of my will not register any of them. If somebody got a question and pick up the phone and call me and I pay the phone call, I got 800 number. Some of the people called me and said, why should I buy something for you instead of one of your competitors? I said, I come with the deal at no charge buddy. I said, what I got between my ears cost me 43 years. It don’t cost you a nickel. You pick up the phone, I’m going to help you and I don’t care if you got a 40 year old Go Devil or you got a $25,000 rig you bought yesterday, you can get the same service, that’s it. I do everything I can to help my customers and that’s just the way I am.
Ramsey Russell: That’s part of being a responsible business on especially in this day and age. You talk about the internet, everybody’s got an opinion and however well informed or ill informed they’ll post it on the internet.

Warren Coco: The funniest thing that hit on me. I talked about Judge Fleabag who hunted with who’s a head judge on the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals. When I met him, I couldn’t, I said, how did this guy get to be a judge? I don’t realize how smart he was and the first thing he told me that it really hit on when things are going down, things are going south, “Keep your mouth shut”. His best saying about people, we had Issue one time running airboats, the landowners and the land manager was a good friend of his. He started his dealing position you had to have an Abbot permit and this that and the other and I never forget Judge Kleberg Collins said, man, he isn’t up with a paper tiger and that really hit home that that reflects on these guys on the internet. They begged people when I get behind them key, stroking them keys, you hit them face to face aren’t nothing but a little puppy dog but their paper tiger behind them keys.

Ramsey Russell: I really respect the fact that forty three years into it with all you’ve accomplished with all you’ve pioneered and with all you’ve done in the hunting industry that when the phone rings, somebody need information, you still answer. My buddy Brandis Ricky over ball shot shells is exactly the same way. I’m the same way this is my business. This is what I do and I value my customers enough to pick them up and help them personally. That’s what we do. That’s part of that, man, I love to do it.

Warren Coco: Well, with me it’s just customer service. And I can help them and help them fix that problem faster than anybody else can, and I’ve got the connections and the service that everybody would want to have, it’s just the parts we stock in inventory. We’ll have somebody, it can be a warranty issued engines still in warranty and rather than him have to go bring into a small engine deal, wait six weeks in the spring time to look at, he can call me, we diagnose the problem. I can see him in a part. He put it on himself, he’s fixed and running and I can get the apart by fire warranty claim on the part and we’re done. It’s all said and done and over, and he never had to bring the product anywhere. He’s got done and he’s ready to roll. And that’s the things we can bypass and make things so I can make things happen quicker than anybody else with my products the way we do things.

Ramsey Russell: Absolutely. That’s the American way of doing things. It sure is. I’m sure enjoyed being here and I wanted to talk today a little bit differently. We’ve talked about hunting all over the state Louisiana, the different places, the different habitats. And Warren, I met you in Washington D.C on a national Wildlife Federation fly in over the marsh and I’m saving that episode later but I learned a lot about you sitting in conference and listening to you. I knew you from your Go Devil history. I knew your involvement in the hunting community and everything else. You started talking pretty intelligently about duck habitat. Yesterday we show up and we made and look at some maps, so your property here and we jump on the buggy and off we go and my head was swimming, looking at your habitat. It was it was really and truly beautiful day, and I both were just doing and on pulling off into some of them duck hold full of all those native grasses, and you pointed out and I could see it immediately that none of that stuff happened by accident. You must be up here a lot and put your hands on this stuff a lot. You have got a lot of irons in the fire just on this property with all the habitat going on.

Warren Coco: Well. It takes a lot. I’m going to quote myself and I told you yesterday different duck holes require different requirements but when you get up in a country like this, this is what I would call farm country in other places, marsh country. This is a work your ass off place. Everybody wants hunt whether kill mallards in the woods, in the timber or farm ground like this, they don’t have a clue what it takes and make things happen, we bought this place, it was when I saw it I said I told my buddy brought me up here so don’t let this place get away. We’ve got to have it and I didn’t have the foresight that I have now and never knew what we’re able to do as time progressed, you’re always in a learning curve. And when I don’t know, I call and ask people, I’ve got friends of the Biologist and I brought a guy from wild life and fish is down here when I drained the lake to make a moist soil unit. He told me what to do and how to do it. And I get people call me a lot of times and I’ll help everybody. I’ll do anything I can, advise and this is what I would do, this is what I think you should do. A lot of people live, most of them listen and it’s just. But you got a micromanager place like this to make it happen. It’s not going to happen on its own and like we were talking about earlier everybody thinks it’s very important to get water on the property to hunt it. Well. It’s just as important to get the water off the property to be able to manage it, to be able to manage and grow. I’ve grown everything from corn to Milo. We’re doing moist soil and I’ve tried just about everything you can do. And different things dictate what you’re able to do. Early on, we bought the place, we don’t have to 10 deer on it a couple years after we got into it, I bought a big talk to start playing corn. Well I can’t play in the air corn now. We don’t have hogs showed up. You’ve got a few buyers in the area and we’ve got too many deer. I can’t grow corn and they’re going to eat it up. It’s just so we’ve got to move on to other things. Right now the best buying for the buck is the moist soil and it just, it takes staying with it and washed it but you got to be able to put the water on it because if it gets too dry, it’s not going to work properly. You can only do that holds that you can add water to, and here on this property we’ve got to irrigation wells, it was on, we bought it. They were not drill for crops that was real for duck holes and with the dirt work I’ve done with the excavator I bought, I’m able to manipulate that water and move that water to places where it couldn’t move before and able to pump more holes and be able to manage it, a little tighter rein on it, getting the grasses and everything growing like we want. It’s just heavily, intensely managed piece of property to make things to get the results that you want to get. You can’t show up here in November come to hunt. This is all your deal.

Ramsey Russell: Let’s talk about because I know I’ve heard the last little bit. Let’s talk about corn because apparently you liked it, you did like planting corn and these duck hunt.

Warren Coco: Corn is ultimate and that’s and that’s a big controversy going on right now, while the ducks aren’t coming. Well. I’ll argue that point, there’s nothing better than corn. First thing to show up when you plant corn or any type of hot food. If you leave soybeans or plant beans or plant milo, first thing shows up as a wood ducks. I had one hole here. We planted corn in the whole; I showed you the whites lake. It’s all surrounded by woods and I got my corn in. It’s real hard to plant corn in because it’s a low bottom. It’s a place you shouldn’t be planting anything. So you’re gambling when you plant got that corner there I grew a great crop of corn at all matured is just starting to dry and I went ahead and put my boards in. Well. It’s called a big rain and it flooded it the corn hasn’t dried out yet but didn’t matter it done matured so it’s going to dry on its own whether it’s flooded or not. When corn is growing, if you get water for two days its toast, you lost it in the summertime. It can’t, corn cannot handle water over the roots. It’s going to die, if you get water over the roots, if you get it off in 10-12 hours, you okay. Stays on the 24-48 hours, its dead. You lost it. Well. Anyway, the corner to the material that was ready and I caught that water too early and it was a few weeks for four weeks for the hunting season, and they were picking cotton, and I’ll never forget my farmer was running cotton picker. They go by that whole there’s trees between the field, and the whole wave of wood ducks will get up out of their circle, back go right back down and you go to the end of the field when you come back and get back up again. They’d every piece of corn out of that hole for the hunt season. The wood ducks, they cleaned it out. It wasn’t there was a piece left eight at all and we didn’t we didn’t kill anything and there was no food left done. But I’ve planted corn in these holes and we did. The first year I planted was 2004. We bought this place, we couldn’t kill enough Ducks and make a gravy. I mean it was on the way. I said, how can a place it looks as good. Not have any ducks. And I’ll never forget one of the two cold managers John Barton. Jr and Jimmy Nugent. Jimmy is one that got me into the deal. Barton says, man, I don’t know if we made such a good deal on this, said, we’re not killing any ducks. And my friend Jimmy, who have been known for 43 years, he says, that’s all right, don’t worry about coco’s going to figure it out. And that’s when I went hunting and stuck. I went hunting stuck guard and went hunting up there with Fred’s Inc kills from Ohio. And they’re playing a lot of corn. He told me that you need to plant corn and more corn. So I asked what I’m going to do. So I go to auction at auction rival Louisiana, North of Johnson. We’re all here and looking a tractor had this big dinosaur was 46-50 dual wheel cabin, therefore Dr. John Deere with had plenty of hours on as well used tractor. I said, that’s just what I need and I’m looking at another guy standing looking out. I got talking to him, found out he was for Marksville, which is just right across the river from, and I tell them so we’re about Black River Point. We bought it for duck hunting. He said, huh? You see, we’re not killing ducks up here anymore find some ducks unlimited. I looked at him. I said, you really believe that, don’t you? He bowed up in the neck. He’s ready to start a fistfight. I said, he looked at me and I told him that so I tell you what I said, they must have bought all the warnings from all the warm ranches and put them out to because they should have stopped him Robbins. He looked at me like he had a revelation. He says, man, I have not seen Robin in three years. I said that’s right. You start seeing Robbins again. You can start seeing green ends again. I’ll blame everything going to ducks unlimited putting out corn stopping all of ducks and like right now there’s a big push. They got this group guy started southwest Louisiana corn illegally flooding these hot crops is illegally stopping the ducks and they’ve got this big push going on to shut all this down. Yes, it’s control yes it’s stopping ducks. I do agree with that. Okay. But everything all the duck hunters are to blame for why the ducks don’t come their shortstop and because people are doing what I’m doing to make that hunting better. When my daddy grew up, they didn’t hunt, they don’t hunt, they’re trying to keep from starving to death. They didn’t have money to spend recreational property, they couldn’t buy a land to hunt ducks on. They were just trying to make a living. Well. Now, all of us that these younger generations like my age, we’ve worked hard. We’ve done well, we’re very fortunate to be able to buy property well everybody wants to make their property better. Well from Canada down, everybody’s enhancing the habitat to me that’s stopping everybody’s pumping water on property, adding water, catching water, putting up levees, putting in structures. It’s not just the corn, it’s the whole picture. The biggest thing has hurt us, I see the last couple of years as the weather’s been too warm and river has been flooding is so much water, so much habitat that’s stopping the ducks. Another issue I got with the corn, South Louisiana, Louisiana was killing more ducks than Cameron Parish where I hunt in southwest Louisiana kills more used to kill more ducks and hold central flyway time. And now our hunting is down central flyways, picked up the killing ducks and in Nebraska an hour in places like there’s a killing ducks and dry bean fields. The only thing you count on and duck hunt things are going to change. Nothing ever stays the same as I’ve mentioned before but our number one duck, If you ask people in south Louisiana, what’s the number one buckshot on coast in south Louisiana, and a lot of people argue with the Green winged teal or gadwall. But that’s what we kill the most of and I’m going to say gadwalls, where I’ve been hunting and where I’ve been hunting different places all my life mouth of the river Creole watershed, hackberry and back to back there again. I say we kill more gadwalls or anything else. Well, guess what gadwalls don’t eat corn. They don’t. The corn didn’t stop them. They didn’t come because of all the habitat there was available above here and the milder winters is why they didn’t come.

Ramsey Russell: I agree.

Warren Coco: My property and Cameron, I just completed a wetland restoration project to enhance the underwater growth, the UAV’s. Aquatic vegetation. And where I had no vegetation, some big areas, I’m 110 percent covered right now with aquatics. I’ve got all food in the world, had it last year, ducks never showed up. We probably didn’t kill and hunting the whole season. 130 ducks in 14 we killed 900 out of two blinds and last year were killed maybe 130 Ducks. It’s just, if we don’t get the weather and I’ve always said, I’ve killed more ducks, fighting mosquitoes and I have ice in south Louisiana but if it’s so much water above us and the wind is a mile, they’re not coming.

Ramsey Russell: Let’s get back on corn because that’s a controversial subject. I know everywhere I go, and here’s what I’m fishing for y’all got some agricultural property here is obviously grows corn. You tell me a little bit about last night, but not all agricultural property grows corn. So much of the agricultural property, especially in Mississippi in the Deep South was cleared back in the 60s to 70s, extremely marginal ground. It was cleared of hardwoods to start planting soyabeans which do have wet feet. We’re here, I thought I got, I was up in North Mississippi and one of the most beautiful oxbows, 1000 acre oxbow of ever laid eyes on it. If the water’s belt deep, it’s knee deep in coon tail, which the God walls love, it’s got great habitat, it’s got all kinds of duck potato, it’s just gorgeous. And we passed another guy going in it’s just a little private lake and with my host and if we were motoring out, we’ve seen somebody there also launching and we got the blind throughout decoys, and he said that’s one of my guys that wants to drain this and plant corn on the lowest part of a flood plain. What my point is, you get so far down the flood plain it just places you aren’t going to grow good corn and even if you do chances are the hogs or the bears of the deer going to eat you out and you don’t have ducks anyway, so but I know you like corn and you were telling me yesterday about all the great results, but you were also telling me what all you had put into it. It aren’t just going out, throw some corn hoping for the best is it?

Warren Coco: What I learned about all these crops, if you’re not ill in 100 percent, don’t do it. It’s not going to work. You’re not going to go out there and plant corn and throw fertilizer on not doing a weed control. You have the weed control, you have the fertilize it, you’ve got to maintain it, you got to do everything a farmer was going to do to grow a crop or don’t do it.

Ramsey Russell: You got to have the right site to do it on.

Warren Coco: That’s right. That’s the key factor. You can’t just because you got a duck over out there. Don’t mean you can plant corn and the corn is a highland plant, it don’t grow in the mud, it don’t like water, it likes the rain.

Ramsey Russell: Its like cotton soul.

Warren Coco: Exactly. Good cotton ground. It’s good corn ground. But corn requires a lot of rain at the right time. Once it’s up and once it’s fertilized and it’s getting on up it starts tassel and putting on ears. That’s when it’s got to have a lot of rain. That’s when the key, that’s why corn is generally planted. They put corn seed in the ground here in March because you get quite a bit of rains in the spring of the year, and then one summer time just here we get rains was like afternoon thunder showers. We don’t get any big rains and what happens then corn don’t grow as well in the high heat like it is, you can make a lot better deal on corn painting early in the spring, well, that’s not conducive with duck on because I don’t want corn, I don’t want plant corn in March to have it ready for November. I need to be planting corn in May or June. And get like hundred day corn where matures. I don’t want it ready early because with how the first year planted corn, my farmer told me go to you raping, go get you some BT corn is genetically engineered fruit worms and boulders and it wasn’t roundup ready. And I had to spray Atrazine and did all that. Man. I made a great crop is the toughest corn you ever saw had about 10 Shucks. Black birds are laying on it, they pack on it, they pecked they eat about an inch of and as far as they could go through the shucks. I think it took a D-9 and knocked them corn stocks down, held up great, lasted the whole season, work great. Next year I went back I said give me some more BT corn and he gave me a different variety is a different brand of Dina group or put it out there. It grew look great. All the shucks opened up loosen up, got loose, blackbirds consumed it. You got you need and what happens that change varieties. They keep modifying the varieties for insect control because like this BT corn is genetically engineered for root worms and boards so you don’t have to deal with those. But the third year I planned I got the same the called BT corn and then it worked out great. Then they quit making that variety. Have to keep changing their varieties because what happens the insects will get immune to that variety. So that’s why they have to keep changing it. Corns are a tough deal to plant and now it’s gotten very expensive. It holds up better than anything else, and its number one in the water and rice is number two and I think in soybeans, somebody was asking about that, he says soybeans aren’t that great? So yeah, they are great, as long as they’re there, they just don’t last long.

Ramsey Russell: I’ve heard that these generation 2-3-4, the more they progress into the technology, these beans rot and I have seen no wet years that these gen four or whatever soybeans sitting out there after, and they get so wet the farmer can’t cut them, I’ve seen them sprout on the vine a few days to rot.

Warren Coco: I’ve seen that too. When I first started hunting up here we got soybeans and cotton on this farm majority of the time and this is really a unique places with the call undulating the swales and ridges, it’s not flat. And we formed, we’ve got all the low mud hole bottoms is where we plant millet, moist soil or whatever we’re playing. I got a few places a little higher than I can flood that I could plant corn in with the hogs bears and dead. Shut that down. I had planted corn about seven years. But it’s just planting and the stuff up here it’s quite a battle. One of the interesting stories, generally all these farmers, they want to come in here and as soon as they get the crop out, they want to chop all the ground. One year they were real late getting everything in and what happens? Well, back up my story, I always heard about hunting and killing ducks in a bean field. You think a duck or eating beans. They’re not eating beans. What happens first rain comes after the crops harvested, you’ve got dry beans on the ground, the spillage, every bean that rain hits sprouts and I said, it’s done. It’s not a food source for ducks anymore and then it burns up with the frost head sitting is gone, there’s nothing left to it. What ducks are generally eaten in the main field is all barnyard grass that comes up after the beans are cut. The barnyard grass is making a seed and the flood that and that’s what the ducks actually eating in my interpretation of what I’m seeing here. A couple of years ago I had an interesting deal happened they got the beans cut late and it didn’t ring, then it got cold and the veins got the spillage on the ground there about half rotten but the duck will still eat them. And they were all over the ground everywhere and I didn’t really pay much attention to it, and we hunted different places one day then that evening at the edge of the wood line overlooking two duck holes, got one of his whole number five and then 150 yards past, we call hole number four. The longer holes, number four is full of Willis that I planted in there for cover. And guys sitting in a deer stand overlooking the field, got their food plot right in front of it and they’re sitting there watching the ducks and then we don’t hunt ducks here in the evening. We only hunt the morning, everybody deer hunting even if they can hunt. He’s sitting there and all of a sudden these wood ducks come out of the hole number four walking, marching across the field feet and dry feet and in the field eating other rotten beans. They walk all over that ridge and get in the next hole of water and stopping that hole of water. He said it was 400 wood ducks came across there never seen that before here. So heard that story side we’re going to hunt hole number 5 in the morning. We went hunted there, being two of our members hunted and we shot a three wood ducks of peace. Which because we had a lot of wood ducks who killed nine wood ducks kill a couple of Mallards, I think they killed pintail didn’t have quite limit, were fairly good hunt. So we kind of shot those birds up a little bit. Next evening somebody got a deer stand. It wasn’t 400 wood ducks out of 200 wood Ducks did the same thing, they marched over that ridge and dry feed in the field and picking up those dry beans. Those beans stayed because it didn’t rain, they didn’t sprout and weather got cold. Then they just lay there and then they’ll still edible, there’s still a food source at that point, even though they were soft and mushy. One time I looked up, got done hunting, my dogs, running around picking up stuff on the ground. So what are you eating? He’s eating those rotten beans.

Ramsey Russell: Rotten soybeans. Lab eats anything. For about five or 6 years since hogs and the bears and the deer. You’ve gone to this more soul

Warren Coco: That’s basically all we can do.

Ramsey Russell: The first thing I thought and I hate to say this because it was just beautiful. The first thing I thought is so many duck hunters I meet today. All they see it’s weed, if it didn’t come out of it of a white bag and you plant, it aren’t no good for ducks and all I could think is I was looking at this beautiful, I saw sprinkle top galore, I saw barnyard grass, I saw some Jap millet y’all had planted in place, I saw pigweed, I saw tooth cup. I saw smart weed I saw sedges and all I can think is so many habitat managing duck hunters. I know the first thought they would have would be I need to round up this and plant corn or plant soybeans or plant milo and I’m like man, this is so beautiful what I’m seeing. But it didn’t happen by accident, did it?

Warren Coco: No. The thing about the moist soil at last under the water that don’t go by it, it’s going to grow back next year. The same seeds that you grew this year is going to be your crop next year that you don’t have to plant. Now there’s different steps to managing more soul you can you have to drain it slow to get the right grasses grow if you drink it fast, it just turns to dry dirt and then all the undesirable plants to grow just to dry. Then you start growing cocker bottles. One thing about cocker bottles, if you’re able to put water on it, you can get rid of the cocker bottles once you moist all gets up, you kind of work it like right, you can put water back on it, put a few inches of water on it and it won’t kill your good grasses, but it will kill those cocker bottles. I learned that from a more salt training had Sherman management area. The state I got invited to go. In fact, bob straight was one got me in there and him and I can’t think of his name was a Biologist who passed away me and one other guy was only two public people that wasn’t abolished to work for the state. They were invited to go that more salt training. I was very impressed that they thought enough for me to invite me to come to that because they knew I was managing this piece of property. I learned quite a bit going there but as you always learn talking to people and learning about other people’s trials and tribulations and mistakes and successes. Everybody learns, you never stop learning when you start managing property like this and things change different years, weather years. One thing I was still playing some milo right now, but we’ve been flooded for the last two years and last year we never got a main crop and I soybeans and cotton in the ground that create income for the farm. We bought this piece of property to hunt ducks on, but we own the property and were sharecroppers, got farmers, we get a percentage of the crop which is helping pay for the property and we got the best scenario here we don’t just have a duck hole and deer hunting hole and place hunt doves and squirrels. This is a piece of property creates income is help paying for it. So it’s just kind of a deal is kind of the best of both worlds now we’ve got 1100 acres the agriculture on 2200 acres, the rest of us horrible land and the open farmland is that’s what most of the deer shot out in the fields, You got deer stands out in the fields and I don’t really hunt the deer, but I’m glad to hear because I got friends that come to like to hunt them and we’ll kill some great bucks off of the place by managing it. It’s just fabulous piece of property. They said we’re managing for all the wildlife.

Ramsey Russell: How would you rate Sprinkle top, How would you rate pigweed? How would you rate Sprinkle top in terms of habitat utilization in terms of good waterfowl, habitat and we’re going to get into how you grew it, how you produce those effects but On a scale of 1-10, what are we, what are we looking at on some of these plants you’ve got out here, some of these quote weeds sitting in your duck hold?

Warren Coco: The thing I remember the most Hugh Bateman, he’s retired, he was while I feel he’s the head of the game division wild life and Fisheries. Then he went to work for ducks in Lebanon and he came out here looking at the place at one point and he saw that Spangle toppy and his quote what he says. “That’s ice cream for a duck”.

Ramsey Russell: Ice cream?

Warren Coco: That’s what he called.

Warren Coco: I’m going to say on a scale of 1-10, 10 being the best at spangled top. That’s probably about 11 or 12 and then you got your smart ways a little bit lower, but they’re still high on the food chain, Pigweed, I’d say is down lower. It’s not quite as good. It’s not something you want to try to manage to grow. Right, a lot of people think Indigo or suspend mania is good that’s on a lower bottom of the chain.

Ramsey Russell: I like to have, I’ve learned doing a little bit of food around like you do on some of our properties two four days there are blazer. There are Herbicides that you can smoke it, smoke that dead gum cough away and get it out because on our site, real heavy clay buckshot lowered food. Water comes off late in the season. Coffee weed coming in and it’ll get Boone and Crockett side to get as tall as a ceiling in here and there’s chemicals that are fixed. But when we’ve gone out and some of these big duck holes and just annihilated it completely. We don’t seem to get the duck utilization that we get if we leave some of it standing, I think it’s just a vertical structure that cover they can hide into but what we’ve seen is you can have all the food in the world you want, but you got to be able to show water the ducks. I’m thinking of ducks flying up in stratosphere, they look down and see that water and work into it. So it to me and I’m just talking about my duck holes and it seemed to be a little bit of balancing equations. Coffee weed is a management problem if you’re trying to grow beneficial grasses but I do think some vertical structure in our duck hold, it offers advantages to waterfowl in terms of being able to get in and get out of the weather get a little thermal barrier or get a little cover or just I don’t know, just go out there and do something, man.

Warren Coco: Mallards especially likes cover and that’s why they really go into the timber and when we’re hunting Mariupol, we had God walls and witches, they work just like Mallards, no difference. You call them just like a mild and lock roll, turn curve and come in but we bought this place. It was this form clean farm dirt to the ground. I mean just no place to hide. We had some pit blinds we put in, you’re sitting out there sticking out like a sore thumb and what you call a coffee weed you just think what I’m calling sucks bean in indigo. It grows real tall. The way I found to control it starts coming up in your more soul holes you go out with a tractor with a bush hog and top it before it makes a seed. You come out there gets up to 2.5 ft high. It hadn’t made a seed yet raises your bush hog up, clip it comes up again, you keep clipping and you’ll eradicate we’re not having to spray it. Actually, we had cotton country here you cannot spray two to four days. We bought this piece of property, I had white Snyder Lake, we had a bunch of floating vegetation in it and it was a wet hole at that time and some floats in it had all kinds of stuff and I told I’m going to get some 2-4 days and round up again. It’s probable you can’t spray that up here. He said, you got cotton, He said 2-4 effects that cops man. I’m dying at bottom. I’m way away from that copy. So I don’t know you understand. Somebody spray to four deal on one side of red river and it affected cotton on the other side of red river. He got more attention and he told me that 2-4 days volatile, it’ll give off vapours and it’ll drift and I never realized that in cotton and tomato plants in the same way, you can’t, if it smells to four day it’s going to affect it. So 2-4 days banned in this part of the world anywhere. They go cotton certain date now, once they start defoliated the cotton and then you can spray 2-4 d.ays But general by that time it’s too late but there’s other things like brassard graham, if you got a real good moist soil hole, you got a bunch of broad least you want to kill you look in, and they got brassard graham and some other stuff.

Ramsey Russell: That’s a granular?

Warren Coco: No, it’s a chemical used to play spread through, spray boom and there’s other broadleaf herbicides now when you start buying selective chemicals, they start getting expensive. Non selective like round up, it costs a whole lot less but you can spray your more soul around and kill everything.

Ramsey Russell: I love travelling. I love seeing, I love meeting and I love sharing my ideas you were talking about like you did over there with that more soul management technique training course because I never quit learning anything and I’ve been managing working with or hunting a very similar property to what we’ve got out here and there were two things I noticed yesterday that made me think myself, we’ve been doing it wrong. And the first one you’re putting a lot of time in the most soil management, you’re getting a lot of bang out of the buck but how are you doing that? It’s not just putting water on, you said before is how clean as a whistle, all of your ditches and drains on. I mean they’re cleaned; you spend a lot of time with that track hoe, don’t you?

Warren Coco: That’s the key to this place when we bought it, we didn’t have any equipment, soon we bought it, first we had to buy was a tractor before we had a tractor, we had one duck, whole lot here was like a volley what I showed you. And we got more soul now, but it drains good, I’ve planted corn in it but one issue I have with if he’ll get a big flood and rain, you can’t get the water off quick enough. But we got more soul in it now and we bought the property and we had the form of playing from Brown Top Millet out there because the previous owners to kill a lot of doves on that places were playing some brown top would shoot doves on and be good duck food a later point time. Well, playing the more soul, I mean were playing at the Brown top, big rain come killed it all. Brown Top can’t take water. Jack Millet can. That’s what all the lessons they don’t understand if you’re in a hole that you risk getting flooded you’re playing Jack Millet. Round top is generally planning for doves on higher ground. It doesn’t like muddy wet ground. We were playing the brown top. It all died all flooded. I went to the farm. I said, how come this whole way of draining, he saw the dishes need clean. I said who knows where those acts or landowner does as well and I went to the next construction auction and Livingston Louisiana because they sell a lot of try coz those and everything. I wasn’t going there to buy when I was just going there to look and I went there and they had the perfect machine I needed because we have a lot of deep, deep ditches here crossing these ridges when they drained all this place that across a lot of ridges, so some of these ditches 20-25 ft deep. Well. Standard track may not reach the other side of the ditch. So I was that it had, it was a little bit older caterpillar, he won 40 with a 50-foot reach on I said, that’s me right there. So I’m leaving with that machine. I bid on a machine. I bought it and I showed up here with that machine these members looked at me like I had three heads and said what this guy, they didn’t buy it, I bought it, I wrote the check for it and I didn’t ask him and I immediately went to work, started cleaning these ditches and they still didn’t say nothing after about two years bought and said look they saw the value of that piece of equipment said look we’re going to pay you for that Escobedo. I said, we are but after I bring it to Hackberry and do some work and when I get done bring it back then we’re going to pay me what I paid for it so no problem and that’s what I did as I had here the Black River points paying for the few parts for the repairs and everything they maintained because all the work was being done on the air when I bought the hat, where did all my work and brought it back. Well, now Black River Point owns escalated that I bought and it’s worked out great. It’s a source of life for this thing and all these ditches have to be cleaned, they have to be maintained. We get big rains, you get mud bars when they got agriculture like this and you’ve got sediments running down building mud bars, backing up water and it requires maintenance at least once a year I got to walk these ditches and clean out any mud balls bill just to maintain all because we’re at the lowest point where we’re forming these duck holes and growing more soul they have to be able to drain if you can’t drain them, you can’t manage them in that piece of equipment is the most valuable to we can have on his farm is an excavator. I’d have an excavator long before I would have a dose. Those are you can rent excavator you need to own if you have enough property justify you got a small place and let’s say you’ve got a half mile ditch you can’t justify. Well I got seven miles of ditches to maintain plus all the structures put in, maintain, putting in pit blinds and just doing general work around the property. I mean it’s just the most valuable to like it I have on this piece of property for this circumstance.

Ramsey Russell: He called it the long arm of the law yesterday, click fighting those beavers to I guess they where you want water, and they don’t want water?

Warren Coco: I’ve had went in talk for days on dealing with beavers. What I found had I went up the road, I had a place I was at least up the road and the drain on it came through another lake and then the beavers had it dammed up ditch, it went in the lotto body went in the red river. What I learned about them babies, You got to bust that damn where you can get to it like you got a dam, you busted where you can reach it and don’t make a big hole and they’ll come back patch and you keep fighting, you take it completely out, they’re going to build a new dam where you can’t get to is what they don’t do. They’re going to beat you they’re going to win. So you just got to outfox them on that one way I outfoxed them when the baby was water control structure is a decoy for a Babel. He hears that water running, he’s going to climb up to and plug that structure and what I found out, once you get the water off place B was gone, they have no water, they can’t stay but they’re in the river. As soon as we started getting right and we start catching water and the water starts overflowing through the rise they come the babies in the river, they come swimming up to ditch, they come in the river swimming, they look up and see this ditch, this water. Oh man! Look at here, they come swimming up that ditch, the first rise, they come to water, they plug in that rise and the way I can maintain them. If I keep Connor bear traps set on that first rise, I can keep off the rest of the places. I’ll catch every one of them as long as you maintain them trap because they’re going to stop the first place they see water and you catch them and you can control them that way but they’re a battle that you just got to deal with it from now on. They’re going to always be in this type of country. They don’t go away. Dude right.

Ramsey Russell: The second thing that I noticed, I’m telling y’all it hit me and back and head like a lightning bolt. We’re sitting here yesterday and you point it to the map, some of these swells out here, some of these duck holes you got. And you said this is not planning a bunch of willows and that’s not planning a bunch of willows my planet by the willows and when I got into some of these duck holes and saw how you planted them, where you plant them and why you planted them. Man, I got a couple of duck holes we’ve been pooling with for 20 years that I’ve been doing it wrong. We need to plant some line to trees out through there to give, talk about that a little bit because that was very those two things the way you keep this water drain to keep those ditches swept that. I mean like rule number one of managing this place from all soiling but number two you went out in these are long folks for these reasons swelled to power. If we look just imagine a piece of corrugated tin. The high part of agriculture low part is duck hole. So it’s just these little fingers, these little ridges where the river meanders thousands of years ago and created these little finger duck hole that’s what we’re talking about here but you went in and planted willow trees. Can you talk about that?
Warren Coco: That was a learning experience. I kind of figured out on my own we had got this place and I mean it was clean when I was not Delta clear that they cleaned everything they could clear and all these bottoms were clear. They didn’t leave anything now. They did leave some timber along the lake beds and stuff like that but we got these duck holes out there and it aren’t up to form dark. You can’t hide on that farm. Don’t you go out there and put a blind, you’re sticking up like a big old sore thumb and man, they’re going to see you and ducks aren’t coming nowhere near you. My farmer had a duck hole up the road. He said, man, I got this duck hole, y’all need to lease. We get quite a few ducks up there, right off the highway. I said, we don’t really need that. We got all we want down here. We wouldn’t kill anything like that before the first three years we couldn’t kill enough ducks and make gravy and they went up there hunting women in wood ducks. It was a will break out in the middle of a cotton and bean field and then wood ducks poured in there. I mean we want that shot limited ducks. He said, when it gets cold and mouths get in here to you and said, well I’m going to take it also, I’m going to lease it from you. So I at least that whole wheat haunted several times a year and at that time did you get really good, but what Willis taught me we go there and lean up against the willow tree like everybody wants hunt in the woods. He had all cover in the world. They need a duck blind anything. I said man this is what we got to do. Second year we had this place, I think it was the second year because it was over three. We bought no one or two season or three seasons. January, 2nd year we had I got one little great story that leads up to this Ricky lane and I were hunting here and when we hunted hard, we split up that morning, so we’re trying to kill some ducks. So I never got a picture of him holding ducks. I think we had three ducks we shot between us. We hunted that morning. We just didn’t have any ducks and I never forget what Ricky said, he said, this place isn’t nothing but a show dog with fleas. I laughed so hard I couldn’t stop laughing. I said, that is the best description I’ve heard in my life. You could have found a prettier place on the north Americana. We just didn’t have any ducks. Well that was low duck years that weren’t coming and I said we just got to do something and after hunting and seeing wood ducks up there and that well, a bright guy said, I know what I’m going to do. Well season ended. Everybody went home last weekend. We all had our lips poked out within killing ducks. I hadn’t figured out and I showed up the next weekend, I had my farm and his helper helping me where I clean the ditch out and dug some small willows up through them up, coming up with mud. Well, they have a lot of them sprouted; they had all fresh green willows growing up 3-4 ft tall. We went along there wagon towed behind my side by side, got there and cut them willows. We cut 2000 willows size of my little finger, and I had we pull the water off the whole, so we went out there wasn’t up with mud and then we walked around the mud, driving out side by side pulling a trailer and I planted those willows three rose eight ft apart, so I had three rose eight ft between them. Then every eight ft I planned it well it wasn’t up but the size of my little finger stuck in the ground, playing down both sides of that duck hole and it’s just like playing any other trees. You got a plan them in January, February is prime time, and I think I had about a 99 survival rate and the way you do it, all you got to do is you push it in the mud as far as you can push it the deeper you put it the faster it’s going to come up because it’s got more bark that’s going to sprout roots to feed the top part of the plan and it can die and that route can still be alive. I had some of them that completely died, burned up, dried up summer time. Look there’s a green sprout coming out of ground at the base. It’s hard to kill a willow. Well, that came up and within five or six years, 20 ft tall. Now you look at him, I mean some of them 18 inches diameter, 17 years old and that there 16 ft apart from outside. They are covering right now you saw, yes, they are probably 75 ft because the limbs grow out, they don’t just grow up they grow out reaching for sunlight and they cover a lot wider than you think they were and if I know what I probably pushed a little wider outside the whole, they’re a little bit more open in the middle. But it’s all been suffice but that’s been the best duck hole on the whole place while playing those Willis. It’s worked out great and I planted on, that was one of three different holes that are playing well zone and it’s all because you couldn’t hide now I’ll show you pictures of some of the greatest hunts we’ve had was on that whole hunting in there killing mallards and wood ducks and to you.

Ramsey Russell: Do you think those willows planting old will has helped the hunting just because it gave you somewhere to hide or was there some wildlife benefit that those ducks?

Warren Coco: It’s a combination, is a place to hide, its seclusion that those ducks like to get in and get out of the wind but not a little story on that I mentioned to nick smith, he’s a biologist. He’s planted how many acres of thousands and thousands of WRP, I mean he’s done a lot of that, and then Van Sharp when it comes all this stuff I’m talking about planting as well as he said. Well. I got a story on him. Well, as he said they had a student. I remember what college he was looking for a project yet you need to do a project and told the professor I don’t know what I want to do. So we’ll go find out why ducks go to will trace. He says I’m going to do that. So he took a clump he took a clump of willows and I asked nick how big was the clump? So, well I don’t know he said but this is what he did. He fenced it off and dipped all the leaves out with all invertebrates, picked everything up, putting buckets. Then he dried it. He picked out all invertebrates and he had 50 pounds of invertebrates that were dried that he picked up around that clump of willows. They’re vertebrates are there because of the leaves from the willows. They’re eating leaves invertebrates of what the hen ducks are looking for waterfowl productions fat and protein man. They’re looking for those invertebrates and so that’s on attractive. Now if the water’s eight ft deep, it’s not going to work, it’s got to be shallow water where they can feed to find those invertebrates to get through those willows. But that’s another plus of the willows that the seclusion for the ducks to get down in there to get out of the wind and out of the weather and it also gives us a place to hide. Well, you put a duck blind, it’s not near as conspicuous. And on that whole we’ve got two blinds on that hole, We’ll hunt both in blinds on the same hunt there 400 yards apart works out great but it’s been our most productive hole and then I have some holes and wide open feel that I won’t plant willows on just to have a little bit different. But I’ve got a low sunken pit blind it’s a ground level and then we’ll cover up with. My best Camou I found, the Will give us a place to hide and there’s a tip for people, not everybody has excavated but excavated makes a lot of easy to get. This part of country we got a lot of red vines and they’re growing on the ditch banks and to me that some of the best camou that you can get you take you can get it with a Reich and you don’t really work hard with the reich but you got to ask access to an excavated with teeth on a bucket and you get them red vines, you pull them up and smile wise that you can handle.

Ramsey Russell: On the side of a wheel barrel?

Warren Coco: No bigger than a wheel barrel. And then stock all that up on your trail and bring it to your blinds and you put that like a pit blind, put that all around the edges and pull it over the top another thing we’ve learned the past few years, lot of people use Willows, you got to cut them with the lay zone with leaves turn almost black. It’s really to darker colour. Well, we started doing with all the Oak trees were playing. We start cutting Oakland’s but you got to cut it while naturally while leaves are still on if you cut it while leaves on it will hold lease. It turns a brand to a brown tan colour. That’s a lot better colour to match. We’ll cover than the willows. So we don’t cut willows anymore to put on a larger blinds. We use oak limbs.

Ramsey Russell: You’re talking about those invertebrates in that leaf litter and it reminded me of a story. I’ve got some associates up in central Mississippi that managed more catfish ponds and the man, they’ve got moist soil and smart weeds and strangled tops and all kinds of stuff they do get a couple of pounds. They draw down and while it’s still soupy mud they go through a bunch of yeah millet onto it and grow it. And I asked him one time I said have you ever killed I galley. I’ve walked on, driven on and done a whole lot of Jap millet and I know the ducks to see because I’ve seen them do it, but Warren have never killed a duck with across full of [**00:55:40]. Just saying and I said that to the man and he’s smiling, he said you know that’s crazy because I agree, he said, he had some I don’t know what they’re from Old Miss or from up north, but a bunch of college kids, Biology students showed up down there doing some research and they took him debts and we’re dragging through the standing water on all these different impoundments and collecting invertebrates, snails and bugs and crawfish and whatnot and just kind of quantifying the amount of that protein and fat rich duck food source. And he said and we had twice as much invertebrate biomass in the Jap millet [**00:56:30] to answer if we did in the natural. And that just made me think, this grass will grow, where, whether it’s wild, whether it’s Jap millet stands stuff, their seed value and I do know that some of the ducks will eat some of the vegetative parts of those plants, but there’s also all that invertebrates, could it at some point in a duck’s life cycle here in the deep south, probably around 1st, 2nd week of January. Man, those mounted hens and therefore the amount of drake that are chasing them, they’re going to transition hard to a protein and fat rich diet. Would you say that’s a big part of having grass or natural grass or most old language just that environment that invertebrate?

Warren Coco: I would totally agree with that biomass, that vegetation is going to grow the invertebrates just like crawfish eat, they grow rice and crawfish pond or you grow moist soil, you got to grow some type of vegetation crawfish to eat and the other invertebrates they’re consuming that also that’s their diet is the decayed vegetation and that’s what the environments living on and that’s what the ducks are going after the environments for the protein, for the egg production and that’s just part of the cycle.

Ramsey Russell: They migrate, they got to fly thousands of miles back home and that takes energy. I remember reading a paper in grad school one time that the greater nutritive fitness that hen mallard was in affected, how many eggs she laid, how successful those eggs were and how many hens were in that clutch because it takes more energy to produce a hen egg than a drake egg. So it’s very important to continuation having a lot of proper nutrition for a duck because they got to fly all the way back up to Saskatchewan Alberta and then make eggs, you point out one last thing I want to ask you about your habitat man down here because man, yesterday, right off the bat you made out of, there was some Jap millet that had come back up, beautiful big seed heads and there’s some native millet, equally beautiful. It is not quite a bigger seed head but you brought out a real good point about a management standpoint. Do you remember talking about the armyworms?

Warren Coco: That’s a big issue.

Ramsey Russell: I never thought about that till you said it.

Warren Coco: The Jap millet. When you plant Jap millet, you better be on guard. You got to have chemical and inventory. It’s not, oh I got Jap, I got worms, I got a call, I will go get some chemicals. You got to have it in shed because when you see the worms you better be mixing a chemical and spread that same day because two days they can clean you out. They’ll come in there and you’re done with the more soul you don’t have the problem but its non-existent, they don’t bother that but Jap millet and the heat once you get, I’ve been told, once you get, it cools off within a min and slows down growing too. And once it cools off and on one problem goes away once you get a good little front that cools off within your millet stops growing also it slows down tremendous long growth, so what I found this part of the world everybody wants to play the jap miller but timing is essential on that too. My theory on that is down here in Louisiana, August one is often date to plant, you don’t want playing in the earlier than August one because then it’s not good mature too early. If you’re playing Jap Millet in August one everything’s going to be fine. That’s a little early but reason I want to play it august one. If I don’t get any rain and it doesn’t come up, I still have time to replant, the latest you want to plant the September one. The planting date is between but I would plant August one, that way if you don’t get any rain it doesn’t come up, you can also come back and replant. That seed will burn up if it’s hot and dry. The heat will pull the moisture out at sea and it’ll go dead and it won’t germinate, so you got to get rained on. If you don’t know ideal situation, you’ve got a whole, you can flush like rice, you can go in and work your ground, plant your millet, flush it, put water and drain it off immediately every seed is going to germinate. Another tip, I want to give people, a lot of people they plant food plus a lot of people buying drill that is the ultimate way to plant seeds. If you plant millet and broadcast it, you’re not going to get 100% germination, it’s never going to happen. So they recommended 20 lbs per acre, 20-25 lbs per acre. When you broadcast, you broadcast, you covered up praying for rain. Well, if you could put it in a drill, young requires 15 lbs per acre. Not that you’re saving money, you’ve got a higher germination rate because you put in that seed in the ground and don’t put about a half inch deep. A little trick I learned, I’ve got a customer across the river Speed Juno, he was a register of voters. Voss passed. He told me something one day that I never knew. It really was really valuable deal for me. I’ve got several 7100 John Deere planners, now these old dinosaurs are like my tractors, Farmers don’t use it anymore they’re not efficient is the new airplane, is that they have but they end up changing sprockets and anybody keep going to run and you’re buying for $300 a piece because they don’t use them anymore and ideally I did, I bought 8 row, 30 inch bean planter, which 30 inches is too wide to plant millet. But he told me, he says, you can plant that millet. He said, he told me I was talking about planting stuff. He says don’t you have a 7100 plants. Yeah, I got three of them. He said put my low plates and slow it down. They said you plant that millet with the milo place. I said really, he said, you sure can. So I went bought me a little scale. Jack my planner up put the millet in it and the Thai rose 7.5 ft. And I did my calculations 210 ft. I think it was like, I can’t remember 24 rounds on the tire and I was going to plant the length and I did all my calculations and I would have this much weight and millet and wound up you had to go to the lowest setting. The slowest setting on its 7100. Now it’s too wide is 30 inches wide, but I’m covering 20 ft, So make one pass, I turn around and come back, line my tires up now making another row and I’m getting my plan is just lined up as close as I can, now I’m planting 15 centres, and that 15 inches with that amount of millet will cover, you feel. And so now you have an inexpensive planner that does a 10 times better job than broadcasting and you get a light rain on generally it’s too dry. It’s not going to doesn’t have enough moisture to germinate now if I was playing it two inches deep, but that’s too deep for millet but first good rain, it’s all everything is going to germinate when you put it in. It’s like the same as using a drill. The 7100 planner cuts the soil like a drill, closes the soil like a drill is actually a drill but it’s not per se a seed drill, like people buying the plant food plots with now or plant rice with it. But we’ll do the same job, a lot less cost and you can still plant if you want to plant corn in it, you want to play Milo in it. It’ll plant all that, it will plant anything you want to plant and some flowers.

Ramsey Russell: Warren, we’re just about out of time. But we are Mid August. We got I think y’all season opens a week before thanks giving or so. We got about 3 months or four. It’s game time down here. Where do you go from here? What are we doing now? What’s coming up next? Will you habitat and you’re hunting camp program. What happens in the next three months for y’all?

Warren Coco: Well, we’re maintaining and getting all the moist soil just checking anything see if it’s the ground and the moist soil is completely cracked and dried and it’s still growing then we’re putting water on it and just moist soil means moist soil. It doesn’t mean crack busted open and keep it moist.

Ramsey Russell: And you don’t mind turning on the well if you got to  relive pumping?

Warren Coco: We’ll fire the well up and put a little water on it. It may let it off but we want to keep it wet, we’ll keep it moist. This time year with bush hogging headlands and stuff that don’t normally get bush all just getting everything kind of cleaned up, getting ready for the hunt season, we started duck hunting but we start squirrel hunting 1st October, Dove season starts 1st September and then I’m so neck deep in the fishing right now. My other place I’ve been there almost every weekend, catching so many by us. It’s just I got I got plenty of things to keep me busy every weekend. I’m either at my place hunting camping, hackberry either I’m up here working. And then I’m working there too. I got things to maintain their but most of the work is pretty much done there now and then we’ll go in one weekend for the season, brush my two floating blinds, get all them set up and then we’re ready to hunt, put decoys out and then we’re ready.

Ramsey Russell: You all have a big work day weekend here at camp, everybody show up to get blind, brushed?

Warren Coco: Hit both camps. We do that. I got, all my buddies hunt with me in the other place, we’ll go there and then our group here, we’ll get together and then they will come, we got hired help. One guy that works on the place year round, we’ll have him pre cut Oakland’s and drop them right where they are. Headlands need trimming anyway, you got stuff you need to cut anyhow, so you cut them and drop them. We drive along in the trailer, toss them in the trailer, drive up the duck blind and place them on a duck blind on site because all the holes will dry. We had plenty of water on yet, we do that right for and then we start pumping water at that point time.

Ramsey Russell: Well. It’ll be here before we know it, Warren and I sure appreciate your time. I know everybody’s enjoyed this I’ve been hearing from a ton of folks about them. Folks, y’all have been listening to Mr. Warren Coco, the general and his habitat sage words of advice from Louisiana. Go Devil motors. Check them out. Thank you all for listening to another episode of Duck season somewhere.